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Thread: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

  1. #21
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon View Post
    6,000 enrollment. They are about the size of most MIAA/LSC schools.
    actually that is just undergraduate. Total is just under 10K. Comparing an enrollment number from a private school to a public school isn't apples to apples in terms of athletic budgets. Private schools can (and do) absolutely SOAK their students with athletic fees that public schools cannot.

    Abilene Christian is reportedly soaking its enrollment of 5,200 to the tune of around $3,000 per student, generating over $15 million a year. Their tuition is quite comparable to St. Thomas.

    So let's say St. Thomas is "only" collecting $2,000 from each of its 6200 students, they are generating north of $12 million annually. I'm guessing it's closer to $15M.

    Those 2,000 enrollment schools can't hang.

  2. #22

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by Herb Street View Post
    actually that is just undergraduate. Total is just under 10K. Comparing an enrollment number from a private school to a public school isn't apples to apples in terms of athletic budgets. Private schools can (and do) absolutely SOAK their students with athletic fees that public schools cannot.

    Abilene Christian is reportedly soaking its enrollment of 5,200 to the tune of around $3,000 per student, generating over $15 million a year. Their tuition is quite comparable to St. Thomas.

    So let's say St. Thomas is "only" collecting $2,000 from each of its 6200 students, they are generating north of $12 million annually. I'm guessing it's closer to $15M.

    Those 2,000 enrollment schools can't hang.
    While the total enrollment is higher than 6,000, undergraduate enrollment is the standard used to describe enrollment (5,938) for comparison purposes. They currently have a $4.8 million budget. Student fees are included in that budget. Of course, they could raise fees to generate income.

    Some interesting numbers searching for the average fees for athletics:

    Florida State: $237
    Virginia: $657 ($13.2 million per year)
    Rutgers: $326 ($10.3 million)
    Auburn: $192

    "Some smaller schools charge more than $2,000 per year in athletic fees, Smith found."

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...=.5af01e57db15

    Alabama and Missouri have eliminated student fees. Kansas State is phasing them out by 2020.

  3. #23

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    In WV - public colleges have an athletic fee and a gender equity fee for athletics... yes a fee specifically earn marked for women’s sports...

  4. #24
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by WVIAC-F-EVER View Post
    In WV - public colleges have an athletic fee and a gender equity fee for athletics... yes a fee specifically earn marked for women’s sports...
    That is discriminatory

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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by 4nick8 View Post
    That is discriminatory
    welcome to the real world, where we fight discrimination based on race and gender, by discriminating based on race and gender.

  6. #26

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    They should go D2. D3 to D2 is a big jump; there's no way they immediately jump FCS to the tune of 63 scholarships, 10K-20K stadiums, and match up. Sure, they might be able to go 3-9 and beat some bottom feeders, who wants that? They should try and get in the Northern Sun, be a strong D2 program and go from there.

    People have no idea the big jump of D3 to D2. The D2 men's national 100 meter championships was just won by a junior from Tiffin in 10.1 seconds -- that time wins the Big 10 meet by nearly a second.

    D3 hoops is a lot of slow guys shooting jumpers; D2 hoops is a lot of guys dunking out. Big difference.
    Last edited by tsull; 05-29-2019 at 12:55 PM.

  7. #27

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by tsull View Post
    D3 hoops is a lot of slow guys shooting jumpers
    This is your best quote ever....although I prefer the older less PC version. ;)

  8. #28

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon View Post
    This is your best quote ever....although I prefer the older less PC version. ;)
    Yes, my older/less PC version was perhaps better. With apologies to Whitman and Whitworth in the Northwest, who have pretty good D3 teams that are fairly athletic ... they'd still get killed in D2.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by tsull View Post
    They should go D2. D3 to D2 is a big jump; there's no way they immediately jump FCS to the tune of 63 scholarships, 10K-20K stadiums, and match up. Sure, they might be able to go 3-9 and beat some bottom feeders, who wants that? They should try and get in the Northern Sun, be a strong D2 program and go from there.

    People have no idea the big jump of D3 to D2. The D2 men's national 100 meter championships was just won by a junior from Tiffin in 10.1 seconds -- that time wins the Big 10 meet by nearly a second.

    D3 hoops is a lot of slow guys shooting jumpers; D2 hoops is a lot of guys dunking out. Big difference.
    St Thomas would be able compete right away in basketball in D2 as they commonly get borderline D1 guys to commit there. They occasionally get the D1 transfer as well. Football would take a couple of years.

  10. #30

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Do they fit in the northern sun?

    Augustana who wins at everything but football at a national level is going D1 - Softball just won the title...

  11. #31
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by Herb Street View Post
    welcome to the real world, where we fight discrimination based on race and gender, by discriminating based on race and gender.
    Discrimination to fix a perceived past discrimination is not discrimination...Or at least that is what an EEO counselor told me once!

  12. #32
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by WVIAC-F-EVER View Post
    Do they fit in the northern sun?

    Augustana who wins at everything but football at a national level is going D1 - Softball just won the title...
    Here are the champions from the last year in the NSIC:

    Football: UMD & MSU both 11-0
    Cross Country: Men- USF Women- Mary
    Soccer: MSU
    Volleyball: UMD
    Men's basketball: Northern
    Women's basketball: UMD
    Indoor track: Men- MSU Women- Mary
    Swimming: SCSU
    Wrestling: SCSU
    Outdoor Track: Men- MSU Women- Mary
    Golf: Men- Winona Women- MSU
    Tennis: Augie
    SB: Augie
    BB: Augie
    Last edited by laker; 05-31-2019 at 07:12 AM.

  13. #33

    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    In the last decade, auggie has had numerous teams make ncaa regional or championship round compared to going up to D1 and making a run will be a rare thing...

  14. #34
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by WVIAC-F-EVER View Post
    In the last decade, auggie has had numerous teams make ncaa regional or championship round compared to going up to D1 and making a run will be a rare thing...
    Big fish little pond versus small fish big pond.

  15. Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    I do think D1 is bloated. They are not 350+ premier colleges in the US. That being said, D2 is turning into D3 with scholarships instead of the resting place for well-funded private and mid-sized state schools that it once was, that now being the low-majors and FCS. So even though I don't think the current D1 environment is sustainable long term, schools should try to move up as it is very important for campus atmosphere and the school profile in general. There is definitely a place for a 4th NCAA division overall.

  16. #36
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Kicking out St. Thomas because they're successful is a joke and I'm glad the MIAC got a lot of bad press over it. They should change their name to The Bush League...a bunch of whiners.
    Go Battlers!

  17. #37
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    Default Re: From D3: U. of St. Thomas kicked out of their league

    Quote Originally Posted by Herb Street View Post
    welcome to the real world, where we fight discrimination based on race and gender, by discriminating based on race and gender.
    Catch 22 personified.
    Go Battlers!

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