Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: PSAC Tournament

  1. #1

    Default PSAC Tournament

    Opinion poll:

    In regard to the conference tournament, ...

    A) All teams should get entered. What's the difference.

    B) The league should keep the current format and the bottom several teams get left out

    C) Only teams with a .500 or above record should qualify

  2. #2

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    Opinion poll:

    In regard to the conference tournament, ...

    A) All teams should get entered. What's the difference.

    B) The league should keep the current format and the bottom several teams get left out

    C) Only teams with a .500 or above record should qualify
    Of the choices, I'd say C , which would usually be the top 4 in each division. I suppose you could take the top 8 overall, regardless of conference for years on conference dominates.

    I'd like to see the top 3 in each division. 2 east v 3 west, 3 east v 2 west. 1 west plays winner of game 1, and 1 east play winner of game two. the two winners then play for the championship. The problem with the current arrangement is just too many games, with poorer teams, giving a chance for injuries or other mayhem - since the players have nothing to lose

  3. Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by ironmaniup View Post
    Of the choices, I'd say C , which would usually be the top 4 in each division. I suppose you could take the top 8 overall, regardless of conference for years on conference dominates.

    I'd like to see the top 3 in each division. 2 east v 3 west, 3 east v 2 west. 1 west plays winner of game 1, and 1 east play winner of game two. the two winners then play for the championship. The problem with the current arrangement is just too many games, with poorer teams, giving a chance for injuries or other mayhem - since the players have nothing to lose
    Agree. I hate when they let undeserving teams into the postseason/conference tourneys, etc.

    It is utterly insane when locally we see 2-7 high school football teams and 4-15 basketball teams competing in the district playoffs. There needs to be a cutoff somewhere in regards to achievement levels.

    -

  4. #4

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    In my opinion, I agree ... it's too much.

    Many refer to the PSAC Tournament as the 'playoffs' ... I don't really get that, either. It's a conference tournament. By default, about half the teams invited have no business being there. The NCAA Tournament, to me, is the playoffs.

    The CIAA Tournament is a great example. Is that 15-15 team that was average for 4 months and then suddenly catches fire for one week really the league champion?

    Why does the PSAC even give a 7-15 team the chance to be crowned the conference champion?

    My guess is the answer is pretty simple. Those games in Round 1 of the PSAC Tournament ... often pairing one 7-15 team against another ... still draw well at almost every location. For many, it is their biggest gate of the year. It's a 'playoff' game after all.

    That alone is why the PSAC rightfully will never go to a neutral site tournament like the MEC or CIAA. I've watched the MEC Tournament for years. Minus perhaps the last few games, the rest were played in a giant arena in front of what looked like 25 fans -- many games during the business day. The PSAC keeping the games on campus up until the Final Four is a pretty neat thing. Night games. They just invite way too many teams to the Little Dance.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    2,971
    Rep Power
    56324

    Default

    I don’t like the move the PSAC made a few years ago to make the final four on a Saturday/Sunday during the afternoon.

    Even in indoor sports, the build up to an evening event is so much a part of the whole experience.

    IUP’s win over SRU in 2013... What an atmosphere. Totally electric. IUPattys helped with that, but it was great build up. There was even a huge crowd for IUP’s thrashing of West Chester on Friday night.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  6. #6

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP24 View Post
    I don’t like the move the PSAC made a few years ago to make the final four on a Saturday/Sunday during the afternoon.

    Even in indoor sports, the build up to an evening event is so much a part of the whole experience.

    IUP’s win over SRU in 2013... What an atmosphere. Totally electric. IUPattys helped with that, but it was great build up. There was even a huge crowd for IUP’s thrashing of West Chester on Friday night.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    100%

    Day games aren't even close to the night game atmosphere. Awful decision.

  7. #7

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    Opinion poll:

    In regard to the conference tournament, ...

    A) All teams should get entered. What's the difference.

    B) The league should keep the current format and the bottom several teams get left out

    C) Only teams with a .500 or above record should qualify
    Either A or B. It's not the Playoffs -- it's a conference tournament. The PSAC has the most restrictive conference tournament in the region. Every team in a D-I conference plays in the tournament. It gives teams something to play for at the end of the season. Why should the PSAC be any different. The NCAA tournament is the one that should be (and is) restrictive.

    I also liked the Friday / Saturday night much better. I thought that the afternoon move was for PCN, but the finals aren't on PCN anymore. Sunday afternoon also provides no margin for error for the NCAA's, who have something like a 6 or 7pm deadline for the game to be completed. Saturday provides a contingency in to Sunday if the game can't be played for weather or a facility problem. This problem happened last year when Gannon was forced to play Ship at an unreasonable time due to travel problems caused by weather. (Gannon did win, but that didn't make the decision reasonable)

  8. Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by Golden89 View Post
    Either A or B. It's not the Playoffs -- it's a conference tournament. The PSAC has the most restrictive conference tournament in the region. Every team in a D-I conference plays in the tournament. It gives teams something to play for at the end of the season. Why should the PSAC be any different. The NCAA tournament is the one that should be (and is) restrictive.

    I also liked the Friday / Saturday night much better. I thought that the afternoon move was for PCN, but the finals aren't on PCN anymore. Sunday afternoon also provides no margin for error for the NCAA's, who have something like a 6 or 7pm deadline for the game to be completed. Saturday provides a contingency in to Sunday if the game can't be played for weather or a facility problem. This problem happened last year when Gannon was forced to play Ship at an unreasonable time due to travel problems caused by weather. (Gannon did win, but that didn't make the decision reasonable)
    I’m on this side. Underdogs getting a shot in March is part of college basketball’s charm at all levels. But the very top teams should never have to play more than 3 games to win a conference tournament, so if you can create a workable tournament around that one caveat, let as many teams as possible in, if not everybody.

  9. #9

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    I don't know the answer to this off hand but do any of you historians out there know who the lowest seeded team was to actually win the PSAC Tournament -- say the past 20 years?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    13,375
    Rep Power
    357006

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by Golden89 View Post
    Either A or B. It's not the Playoffs -- it's a conference tournament. The PSAC has the most restrictive conference tournament in the region. Every team in a D-I conference plays in the tournament. It gives teams something to play for at the end of the season. Why should the PSAC be any different. The NCAA tournament is the one that should be (and is) restrictive.

    I also liked the Friday / Saturday night much better. I thought that the afternoon move was for PCN, but the finals aren't on PCN anymore. Sunday afternoon also provides no margin for error for the NCAA's, who have something like a 6 or 7pm deadline for the game to be completed. Saturday provides a contingency in to Sunday if the game can't be played for weather or a facility problem. This problem happened last year when Gannon was forced to play Ship at an unreasonable time due to travel problems caused by weather. (Gannon did win, but that didn't make the decision reasonable)
    But...Having an unrestricted conference tourney in which all teams play opens the top teams to playing some pretty bad teams in the first and second round which would be a hit on their SOS as well as their PI. Option C (all teams above 500) would give all participants a probable SOS and PI boost.

  11. #11

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    The 'all in' scenario -- for discussion sake -- does have the issue of (8) East teams and (9) West teams.

    Using this year as an example for the West (per today's standings) ... with (9) teams the West would use a 'play in' game between No. 8 and No. 9

    Play-in Game: Clarion at California

    Round 1
    Clarion/Cal winner at IUP
    Edinboro at SRU
    Seton Hill at Mercyhurst
    Gannon at UPJ

    So, to Boat's point, yes, IUP, SRU and Mercyhurst all take a SOS hit by playing that game (all sub .500).

  12. #12

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    The CIAA top 2 seeds in the North and South only have to play 3 games to win the tourney. The bottom 2 seeds, #6-#7, have to win 5 games to win the tourney. The middle seeds #2-5 have to win 4 games to win it all. I like the fact the the tournament is in a central location and all the teams get to participate. One can't really go on just overall records because certain factors may have contributed to those records like injuries and in season transfers. My gut other than VSU winning the tournament is Shaw. I've witnessed all the teams play and Shaw has the most overall talent outside of VSU. Coaching is suspect but I believe they have the best chance to win it. I have attempted to attach the CIAA bracket to get a better understanding of how the tournament plays out.

    Last edited by kjb0615; 02-20-2019 at 02:05 PM.

  13. Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    The 'all in' scenario -- for discussion sake -- does have the issue of (8) East teams and (9) West teams.

    Using this year as an example for the West (per today's standings) ... with (9) teams the West would use a 'play in' game between No. 8 and No. 9

    Play-in Game: Clarion at California

    Round 1
    Clarion/Cal winner at IUP
    Edinboro at SRU
    Seton Hill at Mercyhurst
    Gannon at UPJ

    So, to Boat's point, yes, IUP, SRU and Mercyhurst all take a SOS hit by playing that game (all sub .500).
    The CIAA model that kjb0615 details below is what the PSAC would need to adapt if they were to include everybody. The top 2 teams in each division, or maybe just the champ get double byes into the quarterfinal round, minimizing their chance of an SOS hit. Build the rest of the tournament around that.

  14. #14

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Norris View Post
    The CIAA model that kjb0615 details below is what the PSAC would need to adapt if they were to include everybody. The top 2 teams in each division, or maybe just the champ get double byes into the quarterfinal round, minimizing their chance of an SOS hit. Build the rest of the tournament around that.
    In that case it changes a lot of items.

    For one, the teams get seeded 1-17. Also, in that case, travel becomes a major item. Cal cruising out to East Stroudsburg isn't a short trip. In that concept I think they'd have to go neutral site like the CIAA. That opens a whole new can of worms. My main thing is games don't draw well on campus at most schools let alone neutral site games in Hershey or State College.

    The one drawback in some years is either the West or East is far deeper/superior than the other. The 1-17 seeding eliminates that item.

    There's a coolness to a neutral site tournament. I just fear the games would be played in a giant arena in front of nobody. Think of a game at the Angelo Dome ... 225 people in a 6,000 seat arena.

  15. #15

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    The 'all in' scenario -- for discussion sake -- does have the issue of (8) East teams and (9) West teams.

    Using this year as an example for the West (per today's standings) ... with (9) teams the West would use a 'play in' game between No. 8 and No. 9

    Play-in Game: Clarion at California

    Round 1
    Clarion/Cal winner at IUP
    Edinboro at SRU
    Seton Hill at Mercyhurst
    Gannon at UPJ

    So, to Boat's point, yes, IUP, SRU and Mercyhurst all take a SOS hit by playing that game (all sub .500).
    They take a SOS hit, but are they better off by winning the game than not playing it at all?

  16. #16

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    In that case it changes a lot of items.

    For one, the teams get seeded 1-17. Also, in that case, travel becomes a major item. Cal cruising out to East Stroudsburg isn't a short trip. In that concept I think they'd have to go neutral site like the CIAA. That opens a whole new can of worms. My main thing is games don't draw well on campus at most schools let alone neutral site games in Hershey or State College.

    The one drawback in some years is either the West or East is far deeper/superior than the other. The 1-17 seeding eliminates that item.

    There's a coolness to a neutral site tournament. I just fear the games would be played in a giant arena in front of nobody. Think of a game at the Angelo Dome ... 225 people in a 6,000 seat arena.
    The neutral site tournament also minimizes the regular season. Home playoff games are an advantage that is earned, along with a higher seed by winning in the regular season.

  17. #17

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by Golden89 View Post
    They take a SOS hit, but are they better off by winning the game than not playing it at all?
    Ask Boat. He loves that question. Lol.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    13,375
    Rep Power
    357006

    Default Re: PSAC Tournament

    Quote Originally Posted by Golden89 View Post
    They take a SOS hit, but are they better off by winning the game than not playing it at all?
    They would be better in the W/L % criteria but would be worse in the PI and SOS criterias.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •