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Thread: Best Football Conferences in D2?

  1. #1
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    Default Best Football Conferences in D2?

    What football conferences do you think are the best in d2 football?

    When I think of best conferences the..
    (In no order)

    NSIC
    MIAA
    LSC
    GSC
    GLIAC

    come to mind.

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twincitiesmav View Post
    What football conferences do you think are the best in d2 football?

    When I think of best conferences the..
    (In no order)

    NSIC
    MIAA
    LSC
    GSC
    GLIAC

    come to mind.
    MIAA no question #1
    LSC
    GLIAC
    GSC
    NSIC

    In that order

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    MIAA isn't great the last 2 years. Still good, but definitely a step down from the past.

    Not sure I would put LSC up there with the other 4. Those 4 have some depth and have all put out more than 1 true contender per season in multiple seasons. Not sure the LSC has done that, although they do have some decent depth within the conference.

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Current average ranking of top eight teams in each conference, according to Massey (GNAC does not have 8 teams so I extrapolated)


    MAIAA 13
    GLIAC 38
    GSC 40
    GAC 46
    PSAC 49
    NSIC 51.5
    LSC 51.9
    RMAC 61
    SAC 80
    GNAC 84
    GMAC 86
    NE10 88
    GLVC 93
    CIAA 110
    SIAC 112
    MEC 113

    I used the top eight because all but one conference has at least eight teams.
    Last edited by boyblue; 10-15-2018 at 09:03 PM.

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    It really all depends on how you view the criteria for best conference to be determined. It is the MIAA if you think NWMS winning titles with regularity makes a good conference. It is the GLIAC if you find multiple teams making deep runs with regularity to be what makes a good conference. It is the LSC if you want to go by the conference with the most recent winner. So it is all in the eye of the beholder.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    D2 Rankings are flawed. Perennial power schools are given the huge benefit ofthe doubt.
    Seeing the PSAC ahead of the LSC, RMAC and NSIC seems flawed in that analysis.
    New blood takes time to gain respect. See Tarleton this year. Undefeated and Rolled the defending champions at their place. That said, the top 2 teams in the power conferences always have a chance to go far most years.

    Quote Originally Posted by boyblue View Post
    Current average ranking of top eight teams in each conference, according to Massey (GNAC does not have 8 teams so I extrapolated)


    MAIAA 13
    GLIAC 38
    GSC 40
    GAC 46
    PSAC 49
    NSIC 51.5
    LSC 51.9
    RMAC 61
    SAC 80
    GNAC 84
    GMAC 86
    NE10 88
    GLVC 93
    CIAA 110
    SIAC 112
    MEC 113

    I used the top eight because all but one conference has at least eight teams.
    Last edited by MNXplorer; 10-15-2018 at 09:58 PM. Reason: Added

  7. #7

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by KleShreen View Post
    It really all depends on how you view the criteria for best conference to be determined. It is the MIAA if you think NWMS winning titles with regularity makes a good conference. It is the GLIAC if you find multiple teams making deep runs with regularity to be what makes a good conference. It is the LSC if you want to go by the conference with the most recent winner. So it is all in the eye of the beholder.
    For sure. I tend to think of the strongest eight or so like BoyBlue posted.

    But in spite of what Massey says, my gut feeling this year is that this is the order:

    1. GSC
    2. GLIAC
    3. LSC
    4. MIAA
    5. NSIC

  8. #8

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon View Post
    For sure. I tend to think of the strongest eight or so like BoyBlue posted.

    But in spite of what Massey says, my gut feeling this year is that this is the order:

    1. GSC
    2. GLIAC
    3. LSC
    4. MIAA
    5. NSIC
    Looking at the eighth place team in each conference listed:
    GSC - Delta State and Shorter both 0-5 GSC, 0-7 overall
    GLIAC - Wayne State 0-4 GLIAC, 1-6 overall
    LSC - TAMU-Kingsville 0-4 LSC, 2-5 overall
    MIAA - Central Okla., Emporia State, Mo. Western, Neb.-Kearney, Washburn all tied for fourth at 4-3 MIAA, 4-3 overall
    NSIC - Augie and Sioux Falls both tied for seventh 4-3 MIAA, 4-3 overall

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon View Post
    For sure. I tend to think of the strongest eight or so like BoyBlue posted.

    But in spite of what Massey says, my gut feeling this year is that this is the order:

    1. GSC
    2. GLIAC
    3. LSC
    4. MIAA
    5. NSIC
    How many gsc teams are in top 25? I had the GSC as one of the best but not #1. The NSIC has two teams in the top 5 but there is a MASSIVE dropoff after those two where the next team isn’t receiving votes. The LSC has been good as a conference as of late and have 3 teams that’re in the mix for contending. The miaa is somewhat down this year but is still one of the best and have 3 teams in the hunt for the postseason!

    The GLIAC (imo) has been the best overall conference this year. They just had a #2 vs #3 showdown and still have 4 teams with one or fewer losses. Including Davenport who is a 2nd year program but isn’t eligible for the postseason (someone Clarify rob me as to why?)

  10. #10

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twincitiesmav View Post
    The GLIAC (imo) has been the best overall conference this year. They just had a #2 vs #3 showdown and still have 4 teams with one or fewer losses. Including Davenport who is a 2nd year program but isn’t eligible for the postseason (someone Clarify rob me as to why?)
    Sometimes the number of losses are simply the results of scheduling. If the top teams all played each other at the beginning of the season it looks a lot different than if they play each other at the end. Fpr instance, 6-1 Saginaw Valley still have to play Ferris State, Grand Valley and Davenport. Davenport, who has beaten an NAIA school and a D3 school, still has to play Grand Valley, Ashland, Ferris State, and Saginaw Valley.

    I would have no problem with someone saying the GLIAC is the best. I think a GLIAC team will face a GSC team in the championship.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twincitiesmav View Post
    How many gsc teams are in top 25? I had the GSC as one of the best but not #1. The NSIC has two teams in the top 5 but there is a MASSIVE dropoff after those two where the next team isn’t receiving votes. The LSC has been good as a conference as of late and have 3 teams that’re in the mix for contending. The miaa is somewhat down this year but is still one of the best and have 3 teams in the hunt for the postseason!

    The GLIAC (imo) has been the best overall conference this year. They just had a #2 vs #3 showdown and still have 4 teams with one or fewer losses. Including Davenport who is a 2nd year program but isn’t eligible for the postseason (someone Clarify rob me as to why?)
    Wanted to compare non-con games of Gulf South teams v. GLIAC teams....

    Delta: L 44-13 Tarleton State
    Delta: L 21-10 Grand Valley
    Florida Tech: W 33-14 Benedict
    Florida Tech: W 17-10 Newberry
    Florida Tech: W 26-23 Wingate
    Mississippi College: W 31-30 Clark Atlanta
    Mississippi College: W 34-9 Southwest Baptist
    Mississippi College: L 34-17 North Alabama (FCS)
    North Greenville: W 13-3 Tusculum
    North Greenville: L 51-24 Lenoir-Rhyne
    Shorter: L 66-9 Samford (FCS)
    Shorter: L 61-14 Tusculum
    Valdosta State: W 45-14 Albany State
    Valdosta State: W 55-6 Fort Valley
    West Alabama: W 36-32 Lenoir-Rhyne
    West Alabama: W 37-21 Miles
    West Alabama: W 16-13 Limestone
    West Florida: W 19-9 Carson-Newman
    West Florida: L 38-17 Midwestern State
    West Florida: W 24-19 North Alabama (FCS)
    West Georgia: W 34-3 Catawba
    West Georgia: W 42-14 Limestone
    West Georgia: W 45-21 Albany State


    Ashland: L 21-17 IUP
    Ashland: L 24-17 Ohio Dominican
    Davenport: W 44-7 Robert Morris (NAIA)
    Davenport: W 7-3 Wisconsin-Oshkosh (D3)
    Davenport: W 26-10 Quincy
    Ferris State: W 49-17 East Stroudsburg
    Ferris State: W 59-13 Findlay
    Grand Valley: W 30-7 Indianapolis
    Grand Valley: W 21-10 Delta State
    Grand Valley: W 35-14 Dixie State
    Michigan Tech: W 20-10 Truman State
    Michigan Tech: W 31-30 Hillsdale
    Northern Michigan: L 34-21 McKendree
    Northern Michigan: W 27-22 UT-Permian Basin
    Northwood: L 40-27 Tiffin
    Northwood: L 27-16 Missouri S&T
    Saginaw Valley: W 45-7 Alderson-Broaddus
    Saginaw Valley: W 41-10 Walsh
    Saginaw Valley: W 21-20 Truman State
    Wayne State: W 31-0 Walsh
    Wayne State: L 28-6 Indianapolis

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by boyblue View Post
    Current average ranking of top eight teams in each conference, according to Massey (GNAC does not have 8 teams so I extrapolated)


    I used the top eight because all but one conference has at least eight teams.
    But when you only take the top 8 teams from each conference, you cut off the dreck from a big conference and include it from smaller conferences.

    Massey gives a conference rating

    MIAA
    GLIAC
    GSC
    LSC
    GAC
    RMAC
    NSIC
    PSAC

  13. #13

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horror Child View Post
    But when you only take the top 8 teams from each conference, you cut off the dreck from a big conference and include it from smaller conferences.

    Massey gives a conference rating

    MIAA
    GLIAC
    GSC
    LSC
    GAC
    RMAC
    NSIC
    PSAC
    I would agree with these rankings for the most part. However, with conferences as big as the NSIC and PSAC, the bottom half of those leagues significantly brings down their average. The main point is that there is a formula that you could use to change the conference rankings depending on who you want to be at the top. Just like political surveys.

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horror Child View Post
    But when you only take the top 8 teams from each conference, you cut off the dreck from a big conference and include it from smaller conferences.

    Massey gives a conference rating

    MIAA
    GLIAC
    GSC
    LSC
    GAC
    RMAC
    NSIC
    PSAC
    Exactly, and that dreck is usually responsible for inflating the records of the top teams. I wonder how boyblue’s rankings would look if he used the top 50% of each league. Still doesn’t take away the inflation, but at least the comparisons are a little closer to apples to apples.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Carlson View Post
    Exactly, and that dreck is usually responsible for inflating the records of the top teams. I wonder how boyblue’s rankings would look if he used the top 50% of each league. Still doesn’t take away the inflation, but at least the comparisons are a little closer to apples to apples.
    The corollary is also true. The top teams beat each other up in conference.

  16. Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Here is my problem with the way Div. 2 Football decides playoff entries. I believe the team that is not a traditional power but has just recently become a good team, worthy of being in the playoffs gets punished by either prior years average records or conference affiliation(it is almost like the team has to prove it for multiple years to finally get the benefit of the doubt-I don't think it is fair to that years team). Let me give you an example. Let's say a team finishes with a 9-2 record on the year. One of the losses is to a FCS opponent. The other loss is by a TD or less to a conference team(traditional power) who is ranked. Let's say besides the one loss,none of the conference or non conference games were close games. You would have a team that won every Division 2 game they played that year with the exception of one loss on a late touchdown in the 4th qtr. to a ranked opponent. To me this team deserves entry in to the playoffs, a no brainer right? I believe this exact scenario could very well play out this year and I would bet that this team does not get a playoff bid, based solely on either having a conference thought to be middle of the pack in strength or the fact that they have not been a traditional powerhouse in the past. Now there are lots of games yet to be played so we shall see how things turn out. This just seems like it could happen and would be an obvious unfair outcome. THOUGHTS ????

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by S&TMinerfan View Post
    Here is my problem with the way Div. 2 Football decides playoff entries. I believe the team that is not a traditional power but has just recently become a good team, worthy of being in the playoffs gets punished by either prior years average records or conference affiliation(it is almost like the team has to prove it for multiple years to finally get the benefit of the doubt-I don't think it is fair to that years team). Let me give you an example. Let's say a team finishes with a 9-2 record on the year. One of the losses is to a FCS opponent. The other loss is by a TD or less to a conference team(traditional power) who is ranked. Let's say besides the one loss,none of the conference or non conference games were close games. You would have a team that won every Division 2 game they played that year with the exception of one loss on a late touchdown in the 4th qtr. to a ranked opponent. To me this team deserves entry in to the playoffs, a no brainer right? I believe this exact scenario could very well play out this year and I would bet that this team does not get a playoff bid, based solely on either having a conference thought to be middle of the pack in strength or the fact that they have not been a traditional powerhouse in the past. Now there are lots of games yet to be played so we shall see how things turn out. This just seems like it could happen and would be an obvious unfair outcome. THOUGHTS ????
    I think that, much like March Madness, no matter how many teams you increase the field to there will be teams left out that think they should be in. If this happens this year feel free to say team X doesn't deserve to be in and here is why. I'm betting that team X will be about as justified as whatever team was left out. No real way around it, there will always be tough decisions and good teams being left home.

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by S&TMinerfan View Post
    Here is my problem with the way Div. 2 Football decides playoff entries. I believe the team that is not a traditional power but has just recently become a good team, worthy of being in the playoffs gets punished by either prior years average records or conference affiliation(it is almost like the team has to prove it for multiple years to finally get the benefit of the doubt-I don't think it is fair to that years team). Let me give you an example. Let's say a team finishes with a 9-2 record on the year. One of the losses is to a FCS opponent. The other loss is by a TD or less to a conference team(traditional power) who is ranked. Let's say besides the one loss,none of the conference or non conference games were close games. You would have a team that won every Division 2 game they played that year with the exception of one loss on a late touchdown in the 4th qtr. to a ranked opponent. To me this team deserves entry in to the playoffs, a no brainer right? I believe this exact scenario could very well play out this year and I would bet that this team does not get a playoff bid, based solely on either having a conference thought to be middle of the pack in strength or the fact that they have not been a traditional powerhouse in the past. Now there are lots of games yet to be played so we shall see how things turn out. This just seems like it could happen and would be an obvious unfair outcome. THOUGHTS ????
    The committees are made up two people per conference, so while I suppose your conspiracy theory could happen, I dont think it does. Bottom line, in our region, if you finish with one D2 loss, you're going to be in this year.

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    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by S&TMinerfan View Post
    Here is my problem with the way Div. 2 Football decides playoff entries. I believe the team that is not a traditional power but has just recently become a good team, worthy of being in the playoffs gets punished by either prior years average records or conference affiliation(it is almost like the team has to prove it for multiple years to finally get the benefit of the doubt-I don't think it is fair to that years team). Let me give you an example. Let's say a team finishes with a 9-2 record on the year. One of the losses is to a FCS opponent. The other loss is by a TD or less to a conference team(traditional power) who is ranked. Let's say besides the one loss,none of the conference or non conference games were close games. You would have a team that won every Division 2 game they played that year with the exception of one loss on a late touchdown in the 4th qtr. to a ranked opponent. To me this team deserves entry in to the playoffs, a no brainer right? I believe this exact scenario could very well play out this year and I would bet that this team does not get a playoff bid, based solely on either having a conference thought to be middle of the pack in strength or the fact that they have not been a traditional powerhouse in the past. Now there are lots of games yet to be played so we shall see how things turn out. This just seems like it could happen and would be an obvious unfair outcome. THOUGHTS ????
    Back in 2014, Sioux Falls didn’t get in the playoffs despite being 10-1 and their one loss was to #1 Mankato. That’s being robbed a spot..

  20. #20

    Default Re: Best Football Conferences in D2?

    Quote Originally Posted by S&TMinerfan View Post
    Here is my problem with the way Div. 2 Football decides playoff entries. I believe the team that is not a traditional power but has just recently become a good team, worthy of being in the playoffs gets punished by either prior years average records or conference affiliation(it is almost like the team has to prove it for multiple years to finally get the benefit of the doubt-I don't think it is fair to that years team). Let me give you an example. Let's say a team finishes with a 9-2 record on the year. One of the losses is to a FCS opponent. The other loss is by a TD or less to a conference team(traditional power) who is ranked. Let's say besides the one loss,none of the conference or non conference games were close games. You would have a team that won every Division 2 game they played that year with the exception of one loss on a late touchdown in the 4th qtr. to a ranked opponent. To me this team deserves entry in to the playoffs, a no brainer right? I believe this exact scenario could very well play out this year and I would bet that this team does not get a playoff bid, based solely on either having a conference thought to be middle of the pack in strength or the fact that they have not been a traditional powerhouse in the past. Now there are lots of games yet to be played so we shall see how things turn out. This just seems like it could happen and would be an obvious unfair outcome. THOUGHTS ????
    No. Not necessarily, and it wouldn't necessarily be an unfair outcome. That's only looking at the resume of two teams when there are three other conferences in the region. Theoretically, there could be four undefeated teams and four one-loss teams. Why should the team in your scenario get in over a one-loss team like Grand Valley? That's especially puzzling when the "traditional power" you mentioned got destroyed by Grand Valley this year.

    What if things ended like this:

    Ferris State 11-0
    Grand Valley 10-1
    Fort Hays 11-0
    Northwest Missouri 10-1
    Ouachita Baptist 11-0
    Southern Arkansas 10-1
    Indianapolis 10-1
    Missouri S&T 9-1

    Would it really be unfair if MST were left out?

    The GLVC is not considered to be middle of the pack in terms of strength. It's considered the weakest in SR3 and the results tend to bare that out. Last year, Indianapolis made the playoffs but lost in the first round in a close game to Harding. The year before Southwest Baptist got blown out by Colorado Mines. In 2015, CSU-Pueblo beat Indianapolis by two scores.

    But instead of a hypothetical, let's look at the exact situation. MST's loss to Drake will not have an effect on their playoff participation but is actually not a good loss. SR3 playoff teams worthy of the playoffs typically beat Drake.

    Indianapolis will likely finish 9-1 against D2 competition. Missouri S&T will likely finish 9-1 against D2 competition. Here is the way SR3 COULD end up, which is not as bad as you might have thought...

    In no particular order...

    Ferris State 11-0
    Ouachita Baptist 11-0
    Grand Valley 10-1
    Northwest Missouri 10-1
    Indianapolis 9-1
    Missouri S&T 9-1
    Southern Arkansas 9-2
    Harding 9-2

    Someone please check the accuracy of this. I had to write it in a hurry.

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