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Thread: Iup basketball

  1. #3701
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    Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    Those are real issues. The Dante factor is out of the equation. That can be interpreted many different ways. That factor extended beyond the court, too. I'll leave it at that.

    Tell you what ... he pulls that redshirt crap with Morris or Shawndale ... I'm done with him. As you said, it has got real old.
    Impossible to redshirt Morris. He did that already at TSU.

  2. #3702

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPalum View Post
    Impossible to redshirt Morris. He did that already at TSU.
    It's just never worked and they continue to do it year after year.

    A couple years ago they sat Danielak and then ended up starting a walk-on the second half of that season. Then he sat Keyes on a team that couldn't rebound. Last year it was Ulrich, who is a legit big and rebounder -- on a team that didn't rebound well against better teams.

    All three of them were entering their junior seasons so they weren't scrawny freshmen. It begs the question if he didn't think they were ready ... why sign them?

  3. #3703

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    Joe got Scooter Renkin (who played 8 minutes in the national title game) to redshirt the next year so he'd be available longer. I'm not sure if this message board was around then, but how did/would that decision go over?


    ALSO: Tony C is going into the Indiana County Sports Hall of Fame. If you're a fan of the written word: https://www.indianagazette.com/sport...4cd45b7e5.html

  4. #3704

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by hawks16 View Post
    Joe got Scooter Renkin (who played 8 minutes in the national title game) to redshirt the next year so he'd be available longer. I'm not sure if this message board was around then, but how did/would that decision go over?


    ALSO: Tony C is going into the Indiana County Sports Hall of Fame. If you're a fan of the written word: https://www.indianagazette.com/sport...4cd45b7e5.html
    That was a great article.

  5. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by hawks16 View Post
    Joe got Scooter Renkin (who played 8 minutes in the national title game) to redshirt the next year so he'd be available longer. I'm not sure if this message board was around then, but how did/would that decision go over?


    ALSO: Tony C is going into the Indiana County Sports Hall of Fame. If you're a fan of the written word: https://www.indianagazette.com/sport...4cd45b7e5.html
    Not very agreeable. I believe that was the same year that a frosh named Devon Cottrell got a redshirt as well. I personally found it as frustrating but Cottrell probably did need a year to soak things up.

    -

  6. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    That was a great article.
    Even the part where he says about "poorly written posts?" Surely he was not cutting on us, was he? LOL.

    I personally found the article as a tad arrogant to be honest. He really should have had Matt or one of the other sports writers do it in the same format as everyone else got.

    My one female cousin from New England is married to a guy who is a real professional sports writer. He has written for SI, had offices in New York skyscrapers, had books published and is a national name. Easy here, Tony, anyone of us on here could probably do your job if we really wanted to. And had you gone to a real journalism program like say Northwestern-- you would not hear the professor tell you that only 10% of students can actually do the job. Probably 95% of them could. Just simply offering some perspective, nothing more.

    But it is a fantastic honor for him. He has always done a very good job with things and I have greatly enjoyed his work over these many years. No question about that. Great on the air as well.

    But Goodness can that Bob Fulton guy write. Nobody in the county is on par with him I don't think. Matt does a great job with IUP football and I really like Carly Krouse's efforts with local high school football coverage both in print and the online videos. She is superb at it.

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  7. #3707
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    Quote Originally Posted by IUP CRIMSON HAWKS View Post
    Not very agreeable. I believe that was the same year that a frosh named Devon Cottrell got a redshirt as well. I personally found it as frustrating but Cottrell probably did need a year to soak things up.

    -

    I think a front court player could use a year to gain muscle and get acclimated more to the college game. Guards are different in my opinion.

    With basketball becoming more of a transition, fast break, and three point shooting contest, if you have an athletic freshman that can shoot there’s no reason to not play them. You might have to ease them in early on, but this sent them to Siberia thing until they transfer or they’re a RS Sophomore thing has to stop.

    In all likelihood, that player won’t stay there for four years anyways. It’s like major league teams saving a pitcher’s arm. Why? If you aren’t spending top dollar to resign that guy in two years, get every pitch you can out of him.


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  8. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP24 View Post
    I think a front court player could use a year to gain muscle and get acclimated more to the college game. Guards are different in my opinion.

    With basketball becoming more of a transition, fast break, and three point shooting contest, if you have an athletic freshman that can shoot there’s no reason to not play them. You might have to ease them in early on, but this sent them to Siberia thing until they transfer or they’re a RS Sophomore thing has to stop.

    In all likelihood, that player won’t stay there for four years anyways. It’s like major league teams saving a pitcher’s arm. Why? If you aren’t spending top dollar to resign that guy in two years, get every pitch you can out of him.


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    I agree all the way. There has been WAY TOO MUCH of this sort of thing. It makes no sense at all to me!

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  9. #3709
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    Quote Originally Posted by IUPbigINDIANS View Post
    That was a great article.

    That it was tremendously well written. Ending was awesome. It’s funny how things little things stick with you all these years later.

    Not easy to write an article like that about yourself, but he did an outstanding job.


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  10. #3710
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    Quote Originally Posted by IUP CRIMSON HAWKS View Post
    Even the part where he says about "poorly written posts?" Surely he was not cutting on us, was he? LOL.

    I personally found the article as a tad arrogant to be honest. He really should have had Matt or one of the other sports writers do it in the same format as everyone else got.

    My one female cousin from New England is married to a guy who is a real professional sports writer. He has written for SI, had offices in New York skyscrapers, had books published and is a national name. Easy here, Tony, anyone of us on here could probably do your job if we really wanted to. And had you gone to a real journalism program like say Northwestern-- you would not hear the professor tell you that only 10% of students can actually do the job. Probably 95% of them could. Just simply offering some perspective, nothing more.

    But it is a fantastic honor for him. He has always done a very good job with things and I have greatly enjoyed his work over these many years. No question about that. Great on the air as well.

    But Goodness can that Bob Fulton guy write. Nobody in the county is on par with him I don't think. Matt does a great job with IUP football and I really like Carly Krouse's efforts with local high school football coverage both in print and the online videos. She is superb at it.

    -

    I don’t think it was an arrogant article. I thought it was reflective and well written. I didn’t get any sense of arrogance whatsoever.

    I think his comment about the 10% of kids that come through the program have what it takes to make it is spot on. His professor was right.

    Even at Northwestern or Syracuse, which are big journalism schools, that’s a degree where thousands of other kids with the same dream graduate with across the country. It’s like a running back in the NFL. There’s tons of them. These kids all think they’ll do what your cousin’s husband does. A very small percentage of them ever get the shot.

    Too many kids go to school and get a degree in journalism, sports management, communications media, etc. They all see themselves on tv or making it big time. It just doesn’t happen.


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  11. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP24 View Post
    I don’t think it was an arrogant article. I thought it was reflective and well written. I didn’t get any sense of arrogance whatsoever.

    I think his comment about the 10% of kids that come through the program have what it takes to make it is spot on. His professor was right.

    Even at Northwestern or Syracuse, which are big journalism schools, that’s a degree where thousands of other kids with the same dream graduate with across the country. It’s like a running back in the NFL. There’s tons of them. These kids all think they’ll do what your cousin’s husband does. A very small percentage of them ever get the shot.

    Too many kids go to school and get a degree in journalism, sports management, communications media, etc. They all see themselves on tv or making it big time. It just doesn’t happen.


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    But he's not a running back. Or at least I don't think that he is.

    Kyle Brandt of Good Morning Football on NFL Network was a RB at one time. I find him very gifted with his wit and grasp on popular culture. I wish that guys like him and Chris Simms (Pro Football Talk) could be on the pregame studio show for CBS. They would be great at it.

    -

  12. #3712

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    The killer in that industry is the lack of money. Once (and if) you make it to a big paper ... you do OK. But, before that you'll spend years and years working at rink-dink locals making peanuts. The industry loses a ton of talent.

  13. #3713

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP24 View Post
    I think a front court player could use a year to gain muscle and get acclimated more to the college game. Guards are different in my opinion.

    With basketball becoming more of a transition, fast break, and three point shooting contest, if you have an athletic freshman that can shoot there’s no reason to not play them. You might have to ease them in early on, but this sent them to Siberia thing until they transfer or they’re a RS Sophomore thing has to stop.

    In all likelihood, that player won’t stay there for four years anyways. It’s like major league teams saving a pitcher’s arm. Why? If you aren’t spending top dollar to resign that guy in two years, get every pitch you can out of him.


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    I would certainly, in theory, agree with the bolded comment. In high school, 'big' forwards are about 6'5" to 6'7" and most weigh about 175 pounds soaking wet. Then you show up and get told to go 'man up' to Daddy Ugbede or Patrick Smith, and realize every post you play against is now 6'8", etc.

    There are obviously exceptions. The big man East Stroudsburg played last year was a star by the mid-way point of the season -- and will wreck havoc the next three years (if he stays in D2).

    To Joe's credit, once a player hits the rotation, per se, they don't leave. Manny Yarde was the last 'fringe' rotation player to leave the program early, but, well, that had some 'circumstances' surrounding it.

    I will say this, without question, Joe's love of redshirting transfers has cost him making at least two tournaments.

  14. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by hawks16 View Post
    Joe got Scooter Renkin (who played 8 minutes in the national title game) to redshirt the next year so he'd be available longer. I'm not sure if this message board was around then, but how did/would that decision go over?


    ALSO: Tony C is going into the Indiana County Sports Hall of Fame. If you're a fan of the written word: https://www.indianagazette.com/sport...4cd45b7e5.html
    Scooter was an interesting case. A third reliable scorer certainly could’ve helped lighten the load on Julian and Ashton, and frankly, you probably owed it to those two guys to put the best possible team around them their senior year after all they had done.

    On the flip side, the 2012-13 team desperately needed him, and he led what was probably Joe’s least talented team outside of his first two years to a very successful season.

    I don’t recall too much uproar over the redshirt, but this was a different, much less active board then. I can’t even remember if I was actually a poster or just a reader at that point. Things picked up in ‘12-13 and Joe’s style of play came in to question when West Lib handled them in the regional. That’s when he changed things up and didn’t bring in the slow, plodding bigs to play PSAC smash mouth ball anymore.

    We’ll see if he makes a similar change to his redshirting philosophy.

  15. #3715
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Norris View Post
    Scooter was an interesting case. A third reliable scorer certainly could’ve helped lighten the load on Julian and Ashton, and frankly, you probably owed it to those two guys to put the best possible team around them their senior year after all they had done.

    On the flip side, the 2012-13 team desperately needed him, and he led what was probably Joe’s least talented team outside of his first two years to a very successful season.

    I don’t recall too much uproar over the redshirt, but this was a different, much less active board then. I can’t even remember if I was actually a poster or just a reader at that point. Things picked up in ‘12-13 and Joe’s style of play came in to question when West Lib handled them in the regional. That’s when he changed things up and didn’t bring in the slow, plodding bigs to play PSAC smash mouth ball anymore.

    We’ll see if he makes a similar change to his redshirting philosophy.

    I liked that 2012-2013 PSAC Championship team. That was when I really started to enjoy watching IUP basketball. I was a huge fan of Scooter and Anthony Wells. Devante Chance always talked in interviews his junior and senior year that Wells deserved tons of credit for “teaching him the way” if you will. Thought Wells was a bulldog.

    That was obviously Mathis Keita’s first year on campus as well. Marcel was a junior. That was probably a much better team than you think.

    Really all they were missing was probably another Marcel type front court player and another guy that could run the floor and shoot the three from the guard position.

    The last thing to note is that the IUP-SRU PSAC title game was perhaps the best atmosphere that the KCAC has ever seen. That place was rocking from before the opening tip. Iupattys certainly helped. I had some friends in town for the weekend. One went to Pitt and spent many nights in the Oakland Zoo. He couldn’t get over the atmosphere inside the KCAC that night. Said it was impressive.


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  16. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP24 View Post
    I liked that 2012-2013 PSAC Championship team. That was when I really started to enjoy watching IUP basketball. I was a huge fan of Scooter and Anthony Wells. Devante Chance always talked in interviews his junior and senior year that Wells deserved tons of credit for “teaching him the way” if you will. Thought Wells was a bulldog.

    That was obviously Mathis Keita’s first year on campus as well. Marcel was a junior. That was probably a much better team than you think.

    Really all they were missing was probably another Marcel type front court player and another guy that could run the floor and shoot the three from the guard position.

    The last thing to note is that the IUP-SRU PSAC title game was perhaps the best atmosphere that the KCAC has ever seen. That place was rocking from before the opening tip. Iupattys certainly helped. I had some friends in town for the weekend. One went to Pitt and spent many nights in the Oakland Zoo. He couldn’t get over the atmosphere inside the KCAC that night. Said it was impressive.


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    Joe’s brought a lot of talent in here. Calling that team the least talented among his good teams isn’t meant as a slight necessarily. If you’re ranking those teams, somebody has to come in last, that’s all. That team got as far and accomplished as much as anyone could’ve expected them to.

  17. #3717

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    That was best crowd ever at the KCAC from an atmosphere stand-point. Not even close.

    This past year I'd rank the atmosphere as Ship being the best (Field House) and then SRU. Other than those two it was a lame year. Such a shame.

    And, don't get us started on the crowds for the Regional. Awful.

    I've noticed over the years IUP basketball crowds need a villain to get engaged.

    KR ... Till, Sleva ... the better JR teams.

    Even last year Ship taunted the crowd a bit early and it backfired. Old Sleva could back it up. Not so much his little brother.

  18. #3718

    Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Norris View Post
    Scooter was an interesting case. A third reliable scorer certainly could’ve helped lighten the load on Julian and Ashton, and frankly, you probably owed it to those two guys to put the best possible team around them their senior year after all they had done.

    On the flip side, the 2012-13 team desperately needed him, and he led what was probably Joe’s least talented team outside of his first two years to a very successful season.

    I don’t recall too much uproar over the redshirt, but this was a different, much less active board then. I can’t even remember if I was actually a poster or just a reader at that point. Things picked up in ‘12-13 and Joe’s style of play came in to question when West Lib handled them in the regional. That’s when he changed things up and didn’t bring in the slow, plodding bigs to play PSAC smash mouth ball anymore.

    We’ll see if he makes a similar change to his redshirting philosophy.

    That's really the terrible irony in all of this ... this past team was built to play that up-tempo game with big, athletic post players. Then, of course, they got bounced by an old-fashioned 'PSAC West' team. I still remember watching late that Saturday night when Mercyhurst rallied to beat Fairmont State in overtime. I knew it was over.

    The only thing I know for sure is just about every team that wins the regional (and beyond) has elite guard play. IUP's had very good guard play the past several years but I wouldn't say elite guard play. Granted, you aren't going to have a Chance, Norfleet and Dyer combination every year. I'm a little torn on the 'big man' topic. I know in January and February it's sure nice to have some muscle in the West wars. That said, I watched Joe's 'Euro Bigs' completely destroy Fairmont State last December in their building. But, as we say, they were pretty ineffective on the boards against more powerful forwards/centers.


    I see them being the favorite in the West next year, but not by a ton. UPJ is loaded. Cal will be much better. Mercyhurst is always a pain. Slippery Rock finds a way to be a thorn. He's got a ton of scorer's to play with ... but, they can't all score 20 ppg. Managing personalities may be Joe's biggest task next season. If he does it well they can be a very strong team. He doesn't put up with much crap so I don't see it being a big issue. I am curious if he's going to play that killer schedule again next season. I assume he will.

  19. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP24 View Post
    That it was tremendously well written. Ending was awesome. It’s funny how things little things stick with you all these years later.

    Not easy to write an article like that about yourself, but he did an outstanding job.


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    I laughed at the line about it being easier to work with Joe than for Joe.

    I agree that it’s gotta be really tough to write a piece like about yourself. You can easily go too far in any number of directions, but he really nailed it. Very enjoyable read and much deserved honor.

  20. Default Re: Iup basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Norris View Post
    I laughed at the line about it being easier to work with Joe than for Joe.

    I agree that it’s gotta be really tough to write a piece like about yourself. You can easily go too far in any number of directions, but he really nailed it. Very enjoyable read and much deserved honor.
    After having a chance to have more time with the article in the re-read today---I have to agree with you guys. It actually was really great. And he really went the extra mile to name a lot of the people who influenced him along the way and those he worked with. As you say, it's a real fine line to balance on to write an article like that about yourself. Obviously you can't play the complete Mr. Humble role or hide your gifts in the basket thing or you will have folks stopping you on the street and wondering why you are in the HOF in you didn't do anything. I guess that's why I thought that it would be better to have another writer profile him. But the first person account was really cool too. He did do a rather masterful job of pulling it off. It would not be a very easy thing to do as you all noted.

    He is a very talented guy and we all are lucky to have him. I was actually thinking back to some of his articles he wrote over the years covering IUP hoops and the various sports around the area. He was great at it all. 60-80 hour work week? Good God, I'm not even awake that many hours in a week. LOL.

    I always love to read these HOF articles every May, especially now that I am older and actually know a lot of the folks being inducted. In this year's class I can say that I know John Bomboy and Lou Izodjtic. Both very fine gentleman and very deserving of the honor. I at one time worked with John and I used to play basketball with Lou down in Zink and the Field House on late fall and winter Saturday nights years ago.

    Who are some former athletes and coaches who you think that need to be inducted into the County Hall? Some of these get my vote without thinking about it too long:

    Indiana High- Mike Bertness and John Pettina. Absolutely crazy that they are not in (or at least to the best of my knowledge with these picks).

    Homer Center- Greg Greczek.

    Marion Center- Greg Wilden.

    Purchase Line- Brandon Overdorf. Grant Syster when the time comes.

    Penns Manor- Bill Packer, Marc Paulina, Jason Scott and Matt Gates. Obviously Danny Ferens when the time comes.

    Saltsburg- (maybe crossing into Westmoreland County a bit but these guys all had a huge impact on the local scene) Jeff Fulton, Todd Brosko, and Rich Brown. Also the Pizer father and son combo who starred in basketball.

    Probably scores of female athletes as well need to be in.

    -

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