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Thread: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

  1. #1

    Default Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Rankings were released on October 5th.

    Men's Basketball Preseason Top 25

    1. Bellarmine
    2. West Liberty
    3. Lincoln Memorial
    4. So. Connecticut
    5. Saginaw Valley State
    6. Chico State
    7. Wheeling Jesuit
    8. Northwest Missouri
    9. Alabama-Huntsville
    10. Kutztown
    11. Drury
    12. Cal Baptist
    13. St. Thomas Aquinas
    14. Tarleton State
    15. Lander
    16. Fort Lewis
    17. Indianapolis
    18. Alaska Anchorage
    19. Barry
    20. So. New Hampshire
    21. Indiana (Pa.)
    22. Minnesota State
    23. Virginia Union
    24. East Central
    25. Fairmont State

    source: http://athletics.bellarmine.edu/news...-super-16.aspx

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by CardinalAlum View Post
    Rankings were released on October 5th.

    Men's Basketball Preseason Top 25

    1. Bellarmine
    2. West Liberty
    3. Lincoln Memorial
    4. So. Connecticut
    5. Saginaw Valley State
    6. Chico State
    7. Wheeling Jesuit
    8. Northwest Missouri
    9. Alabama-Huntsville
    10. Kutztown
    11. Drury
    12. Cal Baptist
    13. St. Thomas Aquinas
    14. Tarleton State
    15. Lander
    16. Fort Lewis
    17. Indianapolis
    18. Alaska Anchorage
    19. Barry
    20. So. New Hampshire
    21. Indiana (Pa.)
    22. Minnesota State
    23. Virginia Union
    24. East Central
    25. Fairmont State

    source: http://athletics.bellarmine.edu/news...-super-16.aspx
    Not to stoke the flames of what D2 region is better / tougher / deeper, but the Atlantic has 6 teams in the Top 25. I know, I know, preseason rankings are fluff and generate news stories, and message board fodder, but for what it's worth, that's alot...

    3 MEC
    2 PSAC
    1 CIAA

  3. Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by IUP Extra Mile View Post
    Not to stoke the flames of what D2 region is better / tougher / deeper, but the Atlantic has 6 teams in the Top 25. I know, I know, preseason rankings are fluff and generate news stories, and message board fodder, but for what it's worth, that's alot...

    3 MEC
    2 PSAC
    1 CIAA
    Postseason rankings don't mean much either. We had 4 teams in the final Coaches' Top 25 last year - 5. West Liberty, 6. Wheeling Jesuit, 8. Fairmont State and 24. West Chester.

    West Liberty made it to the Final Four but the three other teams all went down in their regional openers. Sounds like a pretty deep region to me.

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    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by timbertopper View Post
    Postseason rankings don't mean much either. We had 4 teams in the final Coaches' Top 25 last year - 5. West Liberty, 6. Wheeling Jesuit, 8. Fairmont State and 24. West Chester.

    West Liberty made it to the Final Four but the three other teams all went down in their regional openers. Sounds like a pretty deep region to me.
    Conspicuously missing from that list: the defending national champions Augustana. I know they lost a lot of talent from last year due to graduation, but c'mon... not even a top 25 team?

  5. #5

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by ctrabs74 View Post
    Conspicuously missing from that list: the defending national champions Augustana. I know they lost a lot of talent from last year due to graduation, but c'mon... not even a top 25 team?
    No complaints here. I'll definitely agree that it seems odd, particularly in the sense that nearly every defending National Champion is ranked unrealistically high to start the year, but I'd rather see the Vikes prove they deserve to be up in the Top 25 as the year goes on than have them start in the top 5 or 10 and drop out quickly if they have a down year. Obviously my hope is that we won't drop off, but Augie isn't generally a program that "reloads" with D1 transfers the way several other top programs do, so I won't be shocked if we're down for a year or two before we're back up at that Elite Eight level again.

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    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    No complaints here. I'll definitely agree that it seems odd, particularly in the sense that nearly every defending National Champion is ranked unrealistically high to start the year, but I'd rather see the Vikes prove they deserve to be up in the Top 25 as the year goes on than have them start in the top 5 or 10 and drop out quickly if they have a down year. Obviously my hope is that we won't drop off, but Augie isn't generally a program that "reloads" with D1 transfers the way several other top programs do, so I won't be shocked if we're down for a year or two before we're back up at that Elite Eight level again.
    I hope it's not the dramatic dropoff we saw last season from Florida Southern, who didn't even make the tournament.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    That's a good point. Obviously IUP didn't, either, so both teams from the prior National Championship game failed to make the tournament the following year. IUP's lack of invitation was certainly there for the taking but ... call it some self-inflicted wounds in late February.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    WARNING: Some slight thread drift here since it's about a Central Region team and this isn't the Central Region. At the same time, I don't feel like starting an entire thread for this convo in the Central Region forum at this exact moment. If that annoys you, please ignore this post.

    Quote Originally Posted by ctrabs74 View Post
    I hope it's not the dramatic dropoff we saw last season from Florida Southern, who didn't even make the tournament.
    I definitely hope not as well, but I wouldn't be shocked. I think we will have a really strong region this year, with a Northwest Missouri State team in the MIAA that's likely to dominate, an MSU-Mankato team loaded with D1 transfers, and several other NSIC teams ready to step up and fill the gap Augie may leave open (MSU-Moorhead, University of Sioux Falls, Northern State, and a few others are all potential candidates to do this).

    I'll get a little heavy here, as it's something a few of my friends and I have been discussing since we started realizing how things might go this upcoming season.

    One of the problems that really hurts Augie, as I mentioned in my last post, is the fact that we aren't really able to bring in D1 transfers very easily. If you think about it, what National Championship-caliber players...let's take big men, for example...are going to want to come in out of high school and ride the bench behind guys like Jansen, Schilling (both NABC All-Americans this year) and Huisken (who happens to be a very solid big man coming off the bench) for 2-3 years?

    By getting guys like Jansen/Schilling who were so good as underclassmen (both were all-conference from their sophomore through senior years), the Vikes have been left with a bit of a barren cupboard now. Normally teams in that situation would just throw a couple D1 or JUCO transfers on the roster to fill that gap for a couple years while a high school recruit spends a year or two getting ready to play valuable minutes as a junior or senior. Instead, Augie is left with a situation where, for this most recent recruiting class, they were finally able to convince top-level big men (Andy Kerkman, #2 ranked player in Nebraska this past year, as well as a couple bigs from Minnesota) to commit to the program. But they're still only freshmen, so until they're a little more ready to go, they'll be decent, but probably not Elite Eight ready.

    I would say I'll be more surprised if we make the NCAA Tournament this year than if we don't. And in 2-3 years, I'll be really surprised (and somewhat disappointed) if we aren't back in the mix again at a really high level. We have really talented young guys, but our middle chunk of players--sophomores/juniors--just aren't at the same level that our recently graduated seniors were at that age.

    I hope at least some of that makes sense. Like I said, several of my friends and I have been discussing it, but sometimes it makes more sense in my head than it does when I try to type it all out.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    You never know. Transfers get too much hype. There are like, what, 300 'D1' basketball schools. A third of them wouldn't even be great D2 programs.

    IUP has had a strong basketball program for a long, long time. If you look at the last two coaching regimes, one was almost exclusively transfers and the current is a mix.

    In the last 20 years or so of 'transfers' ... I can think of a handful that came in here and really just played at a different level. Two, in particular, really stand out. Several have gone on to solid careers. Several not so much.

    IUP has kind of unofficially taken the stance of not taking 'one year guys' which is a good thing for the program.

    The Atlantic had several tremendous 'true' freshmen last year. Cobo Diaz and Dante Lombardi at IUP, David Dennis at West Liberty. One of the guards at West Chester. They all had some growing pains on certain nights but played well above their class rank.

    That said, to your point, it's probably easier for guards to play as freshmen than it is for the big guys. Just from a size and strength aspect ... they are playing with grown men now and not high school post players.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Jaymon Mason Named to Division II Bulletin Preseason All-American Team

    EDINBORO, Pa. – Division II Bulletin, a monthly newsletter of Division II men's basketball, has announced today its 2016-17 Preseason All-American teams. The selections include Edinboro University's Jaymon Mason (Edinboro, Pa./General McLane), who was accorded honorable mention Preseason All-American honors.

    Division II Bulletin selected a Super 16, which consists of two players from each of the NCAA's eight regions, along with 25 honorable mention selections. Kutztown's Josh Johnson and Matt Bingaya of Fairmont State were the two players selected to the Super 16 from the Atlantic Region. Mason is the only other player from the Pennsylvania State Athletic Conference recognized.

    Mason was a 2016 Division II Bulletin honorable mention All-American, as was backcourt teammate Henri Wade-Chatman. In 2015-16, Wade-Chatman and Mason became Edinboro's first ever tandem to finish with at least 20.0 ppg. in the same season. They were the PSAC's highest-scoring duo at a combined 41.1 ppg.

    Mason was previously selected to the first team NABC All-Atlantic Region team and was a first team All-PSAC West selection. He finished second in the PSAC and 45th in NCAA Division II in scoring at 20.8 ppg., good for tenth all-time at Edinboro. His 542 points ranks 11th in a season at Edinboro. The Edinboro native had twelve 20-point games, leading the team in scoring in 11 contests. This included four 30-point games, which are the most for a Fighting Scot in a season since Tyrone Mason, Jaymon's father, accomplished the feat 11 times in 1995-96.

    A 6'3" guard, Mason shot 45.8 percent from the floor (170-of-371), including 38.9 percent (49-of-126) on 3-pointers, while ranking among the PSAC leaders in free throw percentage at 85.0 percent (153-of-180), good for fourth in the conference. He finished second on the team in rebounds (6.0 rpg.), while adding a team-high 87 assists with 27 steals, second on the team.

    The junior scored a career-high 39 points against Kutztown, along with 36 points at Seton Hill and 35 versus Gannon. He had his fourth 30-point game at Pitt-Johnstown with 34 points while grabbing 12 rebounds for one of three double-doubles for the season. He was named the Division II Bulletin Player of the Month for the month of January.

    Mason broke the school season free throws made record with 153, breaking the previous mark of 139 set by Billy Wade in 1989-90. That total ranked second in the PSAC and tied for 36th in Division II. Mason also finished sixth all-time with 180 season free throw attempts.

    As a freshman, Mason was named the PSAC West Freshman of the Year after starting all 27 games and averaging 14.5 ppg. He shot 86.8 percent from the line (118-for-136). Mason is already 30th all-time at Edinboro with 934 career points through just 53 games and 11th in career free throws made with 271.

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    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    No complaints here. I'll definitely agree that it seems odd, particularly in the sense that nearly every defending National Champion is ranked unrealistically high to start the year, but I'd rather see the Vikes prove they deserve to be up in the Top 25 as the year goes on than have them start in the top 5 or 10 and drop out quickly if they have a down year. Obviously my hope is that we won't drop off, but Augie isn't generally a program that "reloads" with D1 transfers the way several other top programs do, so I won't be shocked if we're down for a year or two before we're back up at that Elite Eight level again.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrAugustana View Post
    WARNING: Some slight thread drift here since it's about a Central Region team and this isn't the Central Region. At the same time, I don't feel like starting an entire thread for this convo in the Central Region forum at this exact moment. If that annoys you, please ignore this post.



    I definitely hope not as well, but I wouldn't be shocked. I think we will have a really strong region this year, with a Northwest Missouri State team in the MIAA that's likely to dominate, an MSU-Mankato team loaded with D1 transfers, and several other NSIC teams ready to step up and fill the gap Augie may leave open (MSU-Moorhead, University of Sioux Falls, Northern State, and a few others are all potential candidates to do this).

    I'll get a little heavy here, as it's something a few of my friends and I have been discussing since we started realizing how things might go this upcoming season.

    One of the problems that really hurts Augie, as I mentioned in my last post, is the fact that we aren't really able to bring in D1 transfers very easily. If you think about it, what National Championship-caliber players...let's take big men, for example...are going to want to come in out of high school and ride the bench behind guys like Jansen, Schilling (both NABC All-Americans this year) and Huisken (who happens to be a very solid big man coming off the bench) for 2-3 years?

    By getting guys like Jansen/Schilling who were so good as underclassmen (both were all-conference from their sophomore through senior years), the Vikes have been left with a bit of a barren cupboard now. Normally teams in that situation would just throw a couple D1 or JUCO transfers on the roster to fill that gap for a couple years while a high school recruit spends a year or two getting ready to play valuable minutes as a junior or senior. Instead, Augie is left with a situation where, for this most recent recruiting class, they were finally able to convince top-level big men (Andy Kerkman, #2 ranked player in Nebraska this past year, as well as a couple bigs from Minnesota) to commit to the program. But they're still only freshmen, so until they're a little more ready to go, they'll be decent, but probably not Elite Eight ready.

    I would say I'll be more surprised if we make the NCAA Tournament this year than if we don't. And in 2-3 years, I'll be really surprised (and somewhat disappointed) if we aren't back in the mix again at a really high level. We have really talented young guys, but our middle chunk of players--sophomores/juniors--just aren't at the same level that our recently graduated seniors were at that age.

    I hope at least some of that makes sense. Like I said, several of my friends and I have been discussing it, but sometimes it makes more sense in my head than it does when I try to type it all out.
    If you're going to write all these words about how our favorite program doesn't usually get transfers then you should be obligated to mention that one of Augustana's probable starting forwards is Mike Busack, a D2 transfer from MSU-Mankato. Facts only.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by Augieholic View Post
    If you're going to write all these words about how our favorite program doesn't usually get transfers then you should be obligated to mention that one of Augustana's probable starting forwards is Mike Busack, a D2 transfer from MSU-Mankato. Facts only.
    That's why I made it a point to emphasize D1 transfers. I do think there's a difference between bringing in several, ready-to-go D1 transfers after losing key players to graduation compared to bringing in one single D2 transfer (the first in the past 2-3 years) who hasn't played since the first semester of last season. But yes, to be fair, we have one D2 transfer who, at this point, will probably come in and either start or immediately compete for substantial minutes.

  13. Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Quote Originally Posted by CardinalAlum View Post
    Rankings were released on October 5th.

    Men's Basketball Preseason Top 25

    1. Bellarmine
    2. West Liberty
    3. Lincoln Memorial
    4. So. Connecticut
    5. Saginaw Valley State
    6. Chico State
    7. Wheeling Jesuit
    8. Northwest Missouri
    9. Alabama-Huntsville
    10. Kutztown
    11. Drury
    12. Cal Baptist
    13. St. Thomas Aquinas
    14. Tarleton State
    15. Lander
    16. Fort Lewis
    17. Indianapolis
    18. Alaska Anchorage
    19. Barry
    20. So. New Hampshire
    21. Indiana (Pa.)
    22. Minnesota State
    23. Virginia Union
    24. East Central
    25. Fairmont State

    source: http://athletics.bellarmine.edu/news...-super-16.aspx
    How is VUU ranked when VSU is expected to go undefeated in CIAA play? Bogus rankings.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Preseason Rankings from the Division II Bulletin

    Don't sweat it. Once that first ball tips these polls mean even less than they do right now. Basketball can change so dramatically from one year to the next and D2 has such a massive amount of player movement -- inbound and outbound -- that preseason projections are extremely difficult (especially on a national level).

    There are teams in the PSAC West this year that are literally like expansion teams ... 75 percent new faces. Some even higher. The die-hard fans in each region can get a pretty good vibe on their respective region but beyond that these polls are just throwing darts blindfolded.

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